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	<title>Comments on: The Knives Your Sales People Should Have</title>
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		<title>By: martin_edi18731</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2009/01/the-knives-your-sales-people-should-have.html/comment-page-1#comment-10711</link>
		<dc:creator>martin_edi18731</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 31 Jan 2009 04:50:09 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>The IT comment was really more about their insistence on &#039;owning&#039; the data which isn&#039;t an option in our case. Fortunately we sell to marketing people...;-) </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The IT comment was really more about their insistence on &#039;owning&#039; the data which isn&#039;t an option in our case. Fortunately we sell to marketing people&#8230;;-)</p>
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		<title>By: bfeld</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2009/01/the-knives-your-sales-people-should-have.html/comment-page-1#comment-10712</link>
		<dc:creator>bfeld</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 31 Jan 2009 04:50:09 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Yup  &#8211; you should definitely have a perpetual license in your sales toolkit.  It&#8217;s great if you never get asked for it, but if you ever do, it&#8217;s  nice to be able to say &#8220;sure &#8211; we can license it that way &#8211;  here&#8217;s what it costs and how it works.&#8221; &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;If  IT never gets in your way on a purchase, that&#8217;s great. But, I&#8217;m  seeing this more and more across all business units (not driven by IT) in  companies making purchases that have lifetime value &gt; $250k.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;My  simple point is that your religion should be around your deployment model, not  your licensing or pricing model.&lt;br /&gt; </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yup  &#8211; you should definitely have a perpetual license in your sales toolkit.  It&#8217;s great if you never get asked for it, but if you ever do, it&#8217;s  nice to be able to say &#8220;sure &#8211; we can license it that way &#8211;  here&#8217;s what it costs and how it works.&#8221; </p>
<p>If  IT never gets in your way on a purchase, that&#8217;s great. But, I&#8217;m  seeing this more and more across all business units (not driven by IT) in  companies making purchases that have lifetime value &gt; $250k.</p>
<p>My  simple point is that your religion should be around your deployment model, not  your licensing or pricing model.</p>
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		<title>By: Has SaaS Killed OSS? &#124; CloudAve</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2009/01/the-knives-your-sales-people-should-have.html/comment-page-1#comment-10688</link>
		<dc:creator>Has SaaS Killed OSS? &#124; CloudAve</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Jan 2009 14:58:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2009/01/the-knives-your-sales-people-should-have.html#comment-10688</guid>
		<description>[...] The Knives Your Sales People Should Have [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] The Knives Your Sales People Should Have [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Brad Feld</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2009/01/the-knives-your-sales-people-should-have.html/comment-page-1#comment-10466</link>
		<dc:creator>Brad Feld</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Jan 2009 21:25:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2009/01/the-knives-your-sales-people-should-have.html#comment-10466</guid>
		<description>That&#8217;s  a good example. It&#8217;s conceivable that you should still do a license like this  under a perpetual model where the customer pays a single payment for a specific  number of &#8220;uses&#8221; or &#8220;proofs&#8221;. You&#8217;d have to build this into the license key  which is incremental work (but trivial on a SaaS deployment), but I think you  could simulate the same affect. However, I doubt this will be anywhere as easy  or logical as in a SaaS model.&lt;br /&gt; </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That&#8217;s  a good example. It&#8217;s conceivable that you should still do a license like this  under a perpetual model where the customer pays a single payment for a specific  number of &#8220;uses&#8221; or &#8220;proofs&#8221;. You&#8217;d have to build this into the license key  which is incremental work (but trivial on a SaaS deployment), but I think you  could simulate the same affect. However, I doubt this will be anywhere as easy  or logical as in a SaaS model.</p>
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		<title>By: Mat</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2009/01/the-knives-your-sales-people-should-have.html/comment-page-1#comment-10449</link>
		<dc:creator>Mat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Jan 2009 22:51:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2009/01/the-knives-your-sales-people-should-have.html#comment-10449</guid>
		<description>Brad 
 
The subscription vs. perpetual analysis is sound, but missed out one key innovation of SaaS, which is the pay-as-you-use model. 
 
As you point out, perpetual and fixed rate subscriptions are really two side of the same coin, although the ability to cancel a fixed price subscription makes it much more flexible. 
 
At ProofHQ we have gone to market with a fixed rate month;y subscription model.  We have different levels of pricing for different profiles of user based primarily on the number of documents that they send for &quot;proofing&quot; each month.  All familiar stuff for users of Basecamp, Freshbooks, etc.  Of course in a minority of cases we are asked for a more traditional perpetual license, even when we are hosting or managing the service and we don&#039;t turn those deals down. 
 
However, what has surprised us has been the number of people who want to buy a &quot;block&quot; of proofs to consume as and when they want.  To me this is the most interesting direction that the SaaS payment model is going in - &quot;pay as you consume&quot;.  I guess the mobile phone companies got there first, then Google with Adwords and Amazon with S3 etc. 
 
They key to maintaining flexibility in pricing models is being able to define a product&#039;s &quot;unit of value&quot;.  In our case &quot;proofs&quot;.  If you get that right then you can apply it across a wide range of license models without too much conflict or inconsistency. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Brad </p>
<p>The subscription vs. perpetual analysis is sound, but missed out one key innovation of SaaS, which is the pay-as-you-use model. </p>
<p>As you point out, perpetual and fixed rate subscriptions are really two side of the same coin, although the ability to cancel a fixed price subscription makes it much more flexible. </p>
<p>At ProofHQ we have gone to market with a fixed rate month;y subscription model.  We have different levels of pricing for different profiles of user based primarily on the number of documents that they send for &quot;proofing&quot; each month.  All familiar stuff for users of Basecamp, Freshbooks, etc.  Of course in a minority of cases we are asked for a more traditional perpetual license, even when we are hosting or managing the service and we don&#039;t turn those deals down. </p>
<p>However, what has surprised us has been the number of people who want to buy a &quot;block&quot; of proofs to consume as and when they want.  To me this is the most interesting direction that the SaaS payment model is going in &#8211; &quot;pay as you consume&quot;.  I guess the mobile phone companies got there first, then Google with Adwords and Amazon with S3 etc. </p>
<p>They key to maintaining flexibility in pricing models is being able to define a product&#039;s &quot;unit of value&quot;.  In our case &quot;proofs&quot;.  If you get that right then you can apply it across a wide range of license models without too much conflict or inconsistency.</p>
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		<title>By: Scott Schnaars</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2009/01/the-knives-your-sales-people-should-have.html/comment-page-1#comment-10444</link>
		<dc:creator>Scott Schnaars</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Jan 2009 16:50:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2009/01/the-knives-your-sales-people-should-have.html#comment-10444</guid>
		<description>In my company, Socialtext, it is a bit easier.  We have a managed appliance that, in 95+% of cases is deployed behind the firewall and licensed in a traditional SaaS model.   
 
While the appliance is installed behind the firewall, as Brad points out, once you stop paying for &#039;maintenance&#039;, there goes support / updates.   </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In my company, Socialtext, it is a bit easier.  We have a managed appliance that, in 95+% of cases is deployed behind the firewall and licensed in a traditional SaaS model.   </p>
<p>While the appliance is installed behind the firewall, as Brad points out, once you stop paying for &#039;maintenance&#039;, there goes support / updates.</p>
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		<title>By: Brad Feld</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2009/01/the-knives-your-sales-people-should-have.html/comment-page-1#comment-10442</link>
		<dc:creator>Brad Feld</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Jan 2009 15:03:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2009/01/the-knives-your-sales-people-should-have.html#comment-10442</guid>
		<description>Remember  &#8211; it&#8217;s &#8220;licensing / pricing&#8221;. So &#8211; in this case, the buyer has to pay the  maintenance to continue to get the service. If it&#8217;s SaaS and they don&#8217;t pay  the maintenance, the service stops. It&#8217;s a different case than desktop  software (like Windows XP) where you &#8220;can&#8217;t turn off the service easily.&#8221; &lt;br /&gt; </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Remember  &#8211; it&#8217;s &#8220;licensing / pricing&#8221;. So &#8211; in this case, the buyer has to pay the  maintenance to continue to get the service. If it&#8217;s SaaS and they don&#8217;t pay  the maintenance, the service stops. It&#8217;s a different case than desktop  software (like Windows XP) where you &#8220;can&#8217;t turn off the service easily.&#8221; </p>
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		<title>By: Phil Sugar</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2009/01/the-knives-your-sales-people-should-have.html/comment-page-1#comment-10441</link>
		<dc:creator>Phil Sugar</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Jan 2009 14:55:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2009/01/the-knives-your-sales-people-should-have.html#comment-10441</guid>
		<description>There are four quadrants...two are the norm.   
 
SaaS subscription model, Behind the Firewall perpetual license.   
 
The next one is harder but doable.  I&#039;ll agree that you can go behind the firewall subscription.  In fact, I think its better to start that way, but given you&#039;re in a perpetual model and you want to move to subscription ok, get ready to feel the pain from the finance types but doable. 
 
I want to see how you deliver SaaS in a perpetual license.   The definition of perpetual is continuing forever.  So the organization can buy once refuse the 20% support and continue to use.  Just like Windows XP.  How does that work? </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There are four quadrants&#8230;two are the norm.   </p>
<p>SaaS subscription model, Behind the Firewall perpetual license.   </p>
<p>The next one is harder but doable.  I&#039;ll agree that you can go behind the firewall subscription.  In fact, I think its better to start that way, but given you&#039;re in a perpetual model and you want to move to subscription ok, get ready to feel the pain from the finance types but doable. </p>
<p>I want to see how you deliver SaaS in a perpetual license.   The definition of perpetual is continuing forever.  So the organization can buy once refuse the 20% support and continue to use.  Just like Windows XP.  How does that work?</p>
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		<title>By: Tim</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2009/01/the-knives-your-sales-people-should-have.html/comment-page-1#comment-10438</link>
		<dc:creator>Tim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Jan 2009 06:07:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2009/01/the-knives-your-sales-people-should-have.html#comment-10438</guid>
		<description>We&#039;ll I&#039;ll just add that Brad and I disagreed on this for about 3 years. He finally won me over about 6 months ago. Sales have gone up as a result. We sell On-Prem and Hosted. We sell 1 year term, 3 year term and perpetual both hosted and on-prem. Sell the way customers want to buy! </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We&#039;ll I&#039;ll just add that Brad and I disagreed on this for about 3 years. He finally won me over about 6 months ago. Sales have gone up as a result. We sell On-Prem and Hosted. We sell 1 year term, 3 year term and perpetual both hosted and on-prem. Sell the way customers want to buy!</p>
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		<title>By: Scott Schnaars</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2009/01/the-knives-your-sales-people-should-have.html/comment-page-1#comment-10437</link>
		<dc:creator>Scott Schnaars</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Jan 2009 06:00:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2009/01/the-knives-your-sales-people-should-have.html#comment-10437</guid>
		<description>We adopted a similar philosophy last quarter - be frictionless. 
 
This stance has allowed us to deliver what our customers need in a manner that they require, not what we want to force on them.  We have our ideal customers and our ideal deployments.  We target them very aggressively, but should one come along that doesn&#039;t fit the mold perfectly, one that wants to buy ergonomic, left-handed knives, we&#039;d be foolish not to have one or two available somewhere.  Be easy to do business with. 
 
To Phil Sugar&#039;s comments, I have an amazingly rich, well structured comp plan (and hiring too).  I have no incentive to push a deal one way or the other, simply to do what is best for the customer.  As a rep in a small start-up, it is also important to do what is best for the company, so I try to structure my deals in a happy medium. 
 
Having all of the knives is a great position to be in.  It allows me to deliver the right solution for my customers and allows them to pay for it on terms that work best for them.  As a sales guy, it makes my life insanely easier as I don&#039;t need to jump through a bunch of hoops to make one off exceptions that ultimately become the rule.  
 
Great post, Brad. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We adopted a similar philosophy last quarter &#8211; be frictionless. </p>
<p>This stance has allowed us to deliver what our customers need in a manner that they require, not what we want to force on them.  We have our ideal customers and our ideal deployments.  We target them very aggressively, but should one come along that doesn&#039;t fit the mold perfectly, one that wants to buy ergonomic, left-handed knives, we&#039;d be foolish not to have one or two available somewhere.  Be easy to do business with. </p>
<p>To Phil Sugar&#039;s comments, I have an amazingly rich, well structured comp plan (and hiring too).  I have no incentive to push a deal one way or the other, simply to do what is best for the customer.  As a rep in a small start-up, it is also important to do what is best for the company, so I try to structure my deals in a happy medium. </p>
<p>Having all of the knives is a great position to be in.  It allows me to deliver the right solution for my customers and allows them to pay for it on terms that work best for them.  As a sales guy, it makes my life insanely easier as I don&#039;t need to jump through a bunch of hoops to make one off exceptions that ultimately become the rule.  </p>
<p>Great post, Brad.</p>
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		<title>By: Sue Kunz</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2009/01/the-knives-your-sales-people-should-have.html/comment-page-1#comment-10431</link>
		<dc:creator>Sue Kunz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Jan 2009 00:42:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2009/01/the-knives-your-sales-people-should-have.html#comment-10431</guid>
		<description>Brad, you nailed it on the head. Having been on the purchasing as well as the sales side of these decisions, in some organizations it&#039;s just easier to get OpEx; in others it&#039;s easier to get CapEx. Personally, I&#039;ve never cared which bucket it came from, as long as it was $s.   
 
One other thing I learned for orgs that offer both is that it&#039;s extremely important to show the customer how the models are cash neutral after x years (x=3-5 depending upon your business).   If you can&#039;t show this, some customers will spend an inordinate amount of time trying to figure out which is cheaper. They need to understand that this is all about being &quot;easy to do business with&quot;, and that&#039;s it. 
 
Comp models are solvable. Even big public companies have been doing this for years. I&#039;ve worked for a few of them. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Brad, you nailed it on the head. Having been on the purchasing as well as the sales side of these decisions, in some organizations it&#039;s just easier to get OpEx; in others it&#039;s easier to get CapEx. Personally, I&#039;ve never cared which bucket it came from, as long as it was $s.   </p>
<p>One other thing I learned for orgs that offer both is that it&#039;s extremely important to show the customer how the models are cash neutral after x years (x=3-5 depending upon your business).   If you can&#039;t show this, some customers will spend an inordinate amount of time trying to figure out which is cheaper. They need to understand that this is all about being &quot;easy to do business with&quot;, and that&#039;s it. </p>
<p>Comp models are solvable. Even big public companies have been doing this for years. I&#039;ve worked for a few of them.</p>
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		<title>By: Brad Feld</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2009/01/the-knives-your-sales-people-should-have.html/comment-page-1#comment-10427</link>
		<dc:creator>Brad Feld</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 19 Jan 2009 20:07:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2009/01/the-knives-your-sales-people-should-have.html#comment-10427</guid>
		<description>Well  &#8211; we have different perspectives. We can argue endlessly, but I can&#8217;t debate  assertions like &#8220;doing it is impossible&#8221; since you aren&#8217;t explaining why it is  impossible. Since I have empirical data that it is possible (from my  experience) I can disprove your statement!&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Re:  paying commissions to get good experienced salespeople &#8211; I agree. However, I&#8217;ve  never run into a great sales exec + great sales force that has struggled with  multiple licensing approaches when the comp plan is clear &#8211; and I strongly  believe you can create a clear comp plan to address multiple licensing issues. &lt;br /&gt; </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well  &#8211; we have different perspectives. We can argue endlessly, but I can&#8217;t debate  assertions like &#8220;doing it is impossible&#8221; since you aren&#8217;t explaining why it is  impossible. Since I have empirical data that it is possible (from my  experience) I can disprove your statement!</p>
<p>Re:  paying commissions to get good experienced salespeople &#8211; I agree. However, I&#8217;ve  never run into a great sales exec + great sales force that has struggled with  multiple licensing approaches when the comp plan is clear &#8211; and I strongly  believe you can create a clear comp plan to address multiple licensing issues. </p>
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		<title>By: Phil Sugar</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2009/01/the-knives-your-sales-people-should-have.html/comment-page-1#comment-10426</link>
		<dc:creator>Phil Sugar</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 19 Jan 2009 19:59:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2009/01/the-knives-your-sales-people-should-have.html#comment-10426</guid>
		<description>1. I think its easy to say: &quot;Defining &quot;forces the issue&quot; is key&quot; doing it is impossible. 
 
2. I think Joel Spolsky is much more eloquent than me on unintended consequences of bonuses.  You have to pay commissions to get good experienced salespeople, I think as soon as you add another order of complexity you can&#039;t make it work. 
 
3. I think you take the tech view and they are both as difficult I agree with your SaaS and behind the firewall comment. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>1. I think its easy to say: &quot;Defining &quot;forces the issue&quot; is key&quot; doing it is impossible. </p>
<p>2. I think Joel Spolsky is much more eloquent than me on unintended consequences of bonuses.  You have to pay commissions to get good experienced salespeople, I think as soon as you add another order of complexity you can&#039;t make it work. </p>
<p>3. I think you take the tech view and they are both as difficult I agree with your SaaS and behind the firewall comment.</p>
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		<title>By: Brad Feld</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2009/01/the-knives-your-sales-people-should-have.html/comment-page-1#comment-10423</link>
		<dc:creator>Brad Feld</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 19 Jan 2009 19:50:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2009/01/the-knives-your-sales-people-should-have.html#comment-10423</guid>
		<description>Thanks  Will. That&#8217;s nice validation coming from you as you are one of the CEO&#8217;s I  most respect about selling (and managing a sales organization).&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Regarding  the public market stuff &#8211; I&#8217;ve completely given up on the validity of public  market analysts. As an investor and entrepreneur, I just don&#8217;t care about them  anymore. My goal is to build companies to maximize cash flow as that&#8217;s the  ultimate driver of economic value. &lt;br /&gt; </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks  Will. That&#8217;s nice validation coming from you as you are one of the CEO&#8217;s I  most respect about selling (and managing a sales organization).</p>
<p>Regarding  the public market stuff &#8211; I&#8217;ve completely given up on the validity of public  market analysts. As an investor and entrepreneur, I just don&#8217;t care about them  anymore. My goal is to build companies to maximize cash flow as that&#8217;s the  ultimate driver of economic value. </p>
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		<title>By: Brad Feld</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2009/01/the-knives-your-sales-people-should-have.html/comment-page-1#comment-10422</link>
		<dc:creator>Brad Feld</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 19 Jan 2009 19:48:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2009/01/the-knives-your-sales-people-should-have.html#comment-10422</guid>
		<description>1.  If this happens, it&#8217;s a weakness in the sales organization and, more  specifically, sales leadership. Excellent sales leadership knows how to  address this. It&#8217;s quite simple &#8211; you have a primary  licensing approach that you lead with. You only fall back on an  alternative later in the process if the customer forces the issue.  Defining &#8220;forces the issue&#8221; is key. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;2.  Same as #1 &#8211; this is easy to deal with if you have strong sales management  that understands incentives and how to structure them. You should be able  to comp the sales organization in a way that that they are indifferent to  licensing. If you want to incent a type of licensing, you can always lean  the comp toward that one, but I think that undermines the idea of giving the  sales people all the knives.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;3.  This is an assertion that obviously is different than mine. I think you  have to build your deployment model one way or the other (it&#8217;s extremely  difficult to have both an SaaS and a behind the firewall deployment model in  the same company). But &#8211; I think you can mix licensing models  easily.&lt;br /&gt; </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>1.  If this happens, it&#8217;s a weakness in the sales organization and, more  specifically, sales leadership. Excellent sales leadership knows how to  address this. It&#8217;s quite simple &#8211; you have a primary  licensing approach that you lead with. You only fall back on an  alternative later in the process if the customer forces the issue.  Defining &#8220;forces the issue&#8221; is key. </p>
<p>2.  Same as #1 &#8211; this is easy to deal with if you have strong sales management  that understands incentives and how to structure them. You should be able  to comp the sales organization in a way that that they are indifferent to  licensing. If you want to incent a type of licensing, you can always lean  the comp toward that one, but I think that undermines the idea of giving the  sales people all the knives.</p>
<p>3.  This is an assertion that obviously is different than mine. I think you  have to build your deployment model one way or the other (it&#8217;s extremely  difficult to have both an SaaS and a behind the firewall deployment model in  the same company). But &#8211; I think you can mix licensing models  easily.</p>
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