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	<title>Comments on: FAS 157 &#8211; Another Annoying Accounting Provision</title>
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		<title>By: Brad Feld</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2008/06/fas-157-another-annoying-accounting-provision.html/comment-page-1#comment-12945</link>
		<dc:creator>Brad Feld</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 07 Jun 2009 03:22:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2008/06/fas-157-another-annoying-accounting-provision.html#comment-12945</guid>
		<description>Yeah  – I guess I never got around to it.  It’s probably time now that a year has  passed and everyone has had to go through one full FAS 157 cycle (and boy did  that work out well.)&lt;br /&gt; </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yeah  – I guess I never got around to it.  It’s probably time now that a year has  passed and everyone has had to go through one full FAS 157 cycle (and boy did  that work out well.)</p>
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		<title>By: Auditing</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2008/06/fas-157-another-annoying-accounting-provision.html/comment-page-1#comment-12930</link>
		<dc:creator>Auditing</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Jun 2009 13:22:08 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I am waiting for your next post. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am waiting for your next post.</p>
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		<title>By: kyle_s10731</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2008/06/fas-157-another-annoying-accounting-provision.html/comment-page-1#comment-9917</link>
		<dc:creator>kyle_s10731</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Jan 2009 01:55:58 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>What is the purpose of this rule? As best I understand (IANAA), to the extent that your portfolio investments grow in value, gains aren&#039;t taxable until you actually take money off the table, which would lead me to believe there are no tax implications. I can understand why it makes sense to value derivative contracts this way, as they can have substantial impact on cash and earnings yet don&#039;t show up on a balance sheet; but venture investments are totally dissimilar from derivatives.  
 
While funds like yours are likely to be above-board, to play by the rules, and to be as conservative as possible, IMHO it&#039;s just a matter of time before an LP sues a less-than-stellar VC for valuing their portfolio companies too aggressively (and thus creating misleading expectations about returns, causing investment in a new fund that wouldn&#039;t have otherwise happened, etc etc).  </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What is the purpose of this rule? As best I understand (IANAA), to the extent that your portfolio investments grow in value, gains aren&#039;t taxable until you actually take money off the table, which would lead me to believe there are no tax implications. I can understand why it makes sense to value derivative contracts this way, as they can have substantial impact on cash and earnings yet don&#039;t show up on a balance sheet; but venture investments are totally dissimilar from derivatives.  </p>
<p>While funds like yours are likely to be above-board, to play by the rules, and to be as conservative as possible, IMHO it&#039;s just a matter of time before an LP sues a less-than-stellar VC for valuing their portfolio companies too aggressively (and thus creating misleading expectations about returns, causing investment in a new fund that wouldn&#039;t have otherwise happened, etc etc).</p>
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		<title>By: devinreams</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2008/06/fas-157-another-annoying-accounting-provision.html/comment-page-1#comment-9921</link>
		<dc:creator>devinreams</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Jan 2009 01:55:58 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Well hmm, it&#039;s not like this was a surprise. New accounting communications such as this come out years in advance to start the discussions like these. 
 
Not to sound snide but you might want to put IFRS on your radar if you haven&#039;t already. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well hmm, it&#039;s not like this was a surprise. New accounting communications such as this come out years in advance to start the discussions like these. </p>
<p>Not to sound snide but you might want to put IFRS on your radar if you haven&#039;t already.</p>
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		<title>By: Dean Leffingwell</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2008/06/fas-157-another-annoying-accounting-provision.html/comment-page-1#comment-9945</link>
		<dc:creator>Dean Leffingwell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Jan 2009 01:55:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2008/06/fas-157-another-annoying-accounting-provision.html#comment-9945</guid>
		<description>Good post Brad.  
Question, wrt to your comment &quot;2. If a financing happens at an increased valuation and is led by a new investor, write your investment up to the new price per share.&quot;  
 
Have you ever seen a case where an up round did NOT include a new investor?  
 
If not, why not, and if so, how do you value that asset? 
 
Dean Leffingwell </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good post Brad.<br />
Question, wrt to your comment &quot;2. If a financing happens at an increased valuation and is led by a new investor, write your investment up to the new price per share.&quot;  </p>
<p>Have you ever seen a case where an up round did NOT include a new investor?  </p>
<p>If not, why not, and if so, how do you value that asset? </p>
<p>Dean Leffingwell</p>
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		<title>By: bfeld</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2008/06/fas-157-another-annoying-accounting-provision.html/comment-page-1#comment-8595</link>
		<dc:creator>bfeld</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Jan 2009 01:55:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2008/06/fas-157-another-annoying-accounting-provision.html#comment-8595</guid>
		<description>Yup - i have seen plenty and participated in some.  Under the old methodology you wuld carry the old rounds at their previous value and the new round at cost.  Under FAS 157 you have to mark everything up to the new price per share. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yup &#8211; i have seen plenty and participated in some.  Under the old methodology you wuld carry the old rounds at their previous value and the new round at cost.  Under FAS 157 you have to mark everything up to the new price per share.</p>
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		<title>By: david_ulevi3244</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2008/06/fas-157-another-annoying-accounting-provision.html/comment-page-1#comment-8597</link>
		<dc:creator>david_ulevi3244</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Jan 2009 01:55:54 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>It&#039;s policies like this that drive inaccurate and over-inflated valuations which ultimately force small growing businesses into unfortunate positions as they raise capital down the road.  Ultimately it&#039;s the economy that suffers as a consequence. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#039;s policies like this that drive inaccurate and over-inflated valuations which ultimately force small growing businesses into unfortunate positions as they raise capital down the road.  Ultimately it&#039;s the economy that suffers as a consequence.</p>
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		<title>By: bfeld</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2008/06/fas-157-another-annoying-accounting-provision.html/comment-page-1#comment-8598</link>
		<dc:creator>bfeld</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Jan 2009 01:55:54 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Correct  – there is no tax impact.  And your interpretation is correct – there is no  real reason to have to do any of this.  But more in the next post.&lt;br /&gt; </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Correct  – there is no tax impact.  And your interpretation is correct – there is no  real reason to have to do any of this.  But more in the next post.</p>
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		<title>By: luca8090</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2008/06/fas-157-another-annoying-accounting-provision.html/comment-page-1#comment-8599</link>
		<dc:creator>luca8090</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Jan 2009 01:55:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2008/06/fas-157-another-annoying-accounting-provision.html#comment-8599</guid>
		<description>HA! You touched a sore spot... 
 
A public company I work with has a convert outstanding which is very illiquid. Because of a depressed stock price and the state of debt market, the occasional small trade takes place at around 70. Since the bond trades deep under par, FAS 157 forces this company to create a significant intangible asset, to be written down over the years until the convert is due. Net results: (1) the company&#039;s balance sheet will be misleading with that asset that has no real value, and (2) net income (for those who care) will be depressed by the writedowns. 
 
Weren&#039;t accounting rules supposed to give a clear and fair view of a company&#039;s financial situation??? 
 </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>HA! You touched a sore spot&#8230; </p>
<p>A public company I work with has a convert outstanding which is very illiquid. Because of a depressed stock price and the state of debt market, the occasional small trade takes place at around 70. Since the bond trades deep under par, FAS 157 forces this company to create a significant intangible asset, to be written down over the years until the convert is due. Net results: (1) the company&#039;s balance sheet will be misleading with that asset that has no real value, and (2) net income (for those who care) will be depressed by the writedowns. </p>
<p>Weren&#039;t accounting rules supposed to give a clear and fair view of a company&#039;s financial situation???</p>
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		<title>By: David McCully</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2008/06/fas-157-another-annoying-accounting-provision.html/comment-page-1#comment-8623</link>
		<dc:creator>David McCully</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Jan 2009 01:55:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2008/06/fas-157-another-annoying-accounting-provision.html#comment-8623</guid>
		<description>Interesting post; however, your FASB criticisms are misdirected in this case.  Don&#039;t feel bad... most of the media make the same mistake. 
 
FAS 157 doesn&#039;t do or cause anything... it&#039;s simply a disclosure standard that categorizes and defines three levels of measurements of fair value.  It doesn&#039;t require the use of fair value accounting at all.  In fact, it doesn&#039;t even tell you how to calculate fair value for anything. 
 
The real financial accounting standards that are causing you heartburn are ones like FAS 133, FAS 141 and others that prescribe fair value accounting. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Interesting post; however, your FASB criticisms are misdirected in this case.  Don&#039;t feel bad&#8230; most of the media make the same mistake. </p>
<p>FAS 157 doesn&#039;t do or cause anything&#8230; it&#039;s simply a disclosure standard that categorizes and defines three levels of measurements of fair value.  It doesn&#039;t require the use of fair value accounting at all.  In fact, it doesn&#039;t even tell you how to calculate fair value for anything. </p>
<p>The real financial accounting standards that are causing you heartburn are ones like FAS 133, FAS 141 and others that prescribe fair value accounting.</p>
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		<title>By: jason4307</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2008/06/fas-157-another-annoying-accounting-provision.html/comment-page-1#comment-8626</link>
		<dc:creator>jason4307</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Jan 2009 01:55:54 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>David, I don&#039;t think this is correct and it&#039;s not a media issue.  As someone who is in charge of our VC being FAS 157 compliant, I can tell you for certain that FAS 157 has several material effects: 
 
1. Uncertainty- as you correctly point out FAS 157 (and the accounting firms themselves) doesn&#039;t tell you HOW to calculate fair value.  What the accountants WILL tell you is that they expect to see changes in the portfolio values each quarter, as &quot;it&#039;s unlikely there is no change.&quot;  In essence, you are forced to prove a negative to your auditors in that you must justify the absence of changing each company&#039;s valuation.  For example, the auditors will tell you that in order to comply with FAS 157 you must make discretionary write ups (and write downs) based on one quarter&#039;s revenue of a startup company that has just started shipping product.  Bottom line, I have no idea how the market values a single quarter of revenue and how that would change the the acquisition price of a company.  But my auditors may not let me leave the value as is because &quot;something has changed.&quot; 
 
2.  Volatility - Much because of #1, above and also due to the fact that under FAS 157 valuations are changed outside of funding events, valuations change much more often and the volatility of the portfolio asset valuations have dramatically increased.  I&#039;d have no issue with this if I thought they were more accurate than the &quot;old days,&quot; but it definitely feels strange to me that a much more discretionary and arbitrary valuation methodology is also adding to volatility.   
 
3.  Reliance - &quot;Simply a disclosure standard&quot; is not correct.  LPs / investors are relying on these numbers as the correct valuation of the assets.  Our VC track records and fund raising presentations are showing these numbers.  People rely on these numbers, get paid bonuses per these numbers and their potential inaccuracies and / or volatility can have material liability issues. 
 
I could go on for a while - I won&#039;t.  :)  But as the guy sitting in the audit committee meetings with the auditors, I&#039;ve seen this up close and personal and besides the frustrations and costs associated with FAS 157, there are real, material effects. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>David, I don&#039;t think this is correct and it&#039;s not a media issue.  As someone who is in charge of our VC being FAS 157 compliant, I can tell you for certain that FAS 157 has several material effects: </p>
<p>1. Uncertainty- as you correctly point out FAS 157 (and the accounting firms themselves) doesn&#039;t tell you HOW to calculate fair value.  What the accountants WILL tell you is that they expect to see changes in the portfolio values each quarter, as &quot;it&#039;s unlikely there is no change.&quot;  In essence, you are forced to prove a negative to your auditors in that you must justify the absence of changing each company&#039;s valuation.  For example, the auditors will tell you that in order to comply with FAS 157 you must make discretionary write ups (and write downs) based on one quarter&#039;s revenue of a startup company that has just started shipping product.  Bottom line, I have no idea how the market values a single quarter of revenue and how that would change the the acquisition price of a company.  But my auditors may not let me leave the value as is because &quot;something has changed.&quot; </p>
<p>2.  Volatility &#8211; Much because of #1, above and also due to the fact that under FAS 157 valuations are changed outside of funding events, valuations change much more often and the volatility of the portfolio asset valuations have dramatically increased.  I&#039;d have no issue with this if I thought they were more accurate than the &quot;old days,&quot; but it definitely feels strange to me that a much more discretionary and arbitrary valuation methodology is also adding to volatility.   </p>
<p>3.  Reliance &#8211; &quot;Simply a disclosure standard&quot; is not correct.  LPs / investors are relying on these numbers as the correct valuation of the assets.  Our VC track records and fund raising presentations are showing these numbers.  People rely on these numbers, get paid bonuses per these numbers and their potential inaccuracies and / or volatility can have material liability issues. </p>
<p>I could go on for a while &#8211; I won&#039;t.  <img src='http://www.feld.com/wp/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' />   But as the guy sitting in the audit committee meetings with the auditors, I&#039;ve seen this up close and personal and besides the frustrations and costs associated with FAS 157, there are real, material effects.</p>
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		<title>By: bfeld</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2008/06/fas-157-another-annoying-accounting-provision.html/comment-page-1#comment-8627</link>
		<dc:creator>bfeld</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Jan 2009 01:55:54 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Oh  – we’ve known about this since 2006.  That doesn’t make in any less palatable.   &lt;br /&gt; </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh  – we’ve known about this since 2006.  That doesn’t make in any less palatable.   </p>
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		<title>By: Chris Mercer</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2008/06/fas-157-another-annoying-accounting-provision.html/comment-page-1#comment-8628</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris Mercer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Jan 2009 01:55:54 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I&#039;ll wait for the next post before commenting further. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#039;ll wait for the next post before commenting further.</p>
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		<title>By: devinreams</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2008/06/fas-157-another-annoying-accounting-provision.html/comment-page-1#comment-8629</link>
		<dc:creator>devinreams</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Jan 2009 01:55:54 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Right, I agree. The beauty of a self-regulating industry. To your point, it means more fees for &quot;us&quot;. That hurt to type. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Right, I agree. The beauty of a self-regulating industry. To your point, it means more fees for &quot;us&quot;. That hurt to type.</p>
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