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	<title>Comments on: My Afternoon at the Boulder County Justice Center</title>
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		<title>By: Fred Noelke</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2006/03/my-afternoon-at-the-boulder-county-justice-center.html/comment-page-1#comment-2537</link>
		<dc:creator>Fred Noelke</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Nov 2007 20:13:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feld.com/wp/?p=938#comment-2537</guid>
		<description>I stumbled across your blog. I had two encounters with the Boulder Justice. It changed my entire life. I lost my sense of community and have never regained it. Going to any prison is torture.

I also wanted to mention that I have a 61 year old roommate that went to Nam. The government just caught up with him on his 2400 dollar GIbill Loan that has now turned into 15,000. He has PTSD like most veterans and has had a rough life. Any ideas?

Fred
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I stumbled across your blog. I had two encounters with the Boulder Justice. It changed my entire life. I lost my sense of community and have never regained it. Going to any prison is torture.</p>
<p>I also wanted to mention that I have a 61 year old roommate that went to Nam. The government just caught up with him on his 2400 dollar GIbill Loan that has now turned into 15,000. He has PTSD like most veterans and has had a rough life. Any ideas?</p>
<p>Fred</p>
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		<title>By: Tom O'Neill</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2006/03/my-afternoon-at-the-boulder-county-justice-center.html/comment-page-1#comment-2536</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom O'Neill</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Mar 2006 00:38:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feld.com/wp/?p=938#comment-2536</guid>
		<description>Not only do I see no good in putting this man in a cell, it is in direct logical conflict with the notion of property rights.

If Coach stole (via force or fraud) the property of victims A,B, and C, then only A,B and C have a just claim against Coach in the amount of their losses, plus recovery expenses. They have every right to hire an enforcement agency to recover these losses through Coach&#039;s assets or future income.

In this case, the prosecutor &quot;P&quot;, enters the scene to punish Coach. He claims to represent A,B and C, but actually represents the state (and his own political aspirations - see Spitzer) whose interests are often adverse to the victim&#039;s. Putting the man behind bars for 12 years completely eliminates any chance for him to repay his victims, and worse, the victims are forced to pay bear the costs (probably north of $1.2MM) for their theif&#039;s upkeep for the next 12 years (along with the other local taxpayers).

Hardly what I would call &quot;justice,&quot; were I a victim of Coach&#039;s actions.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Not only do I see no good in putting this man in a cell, it is in direct logical conflict with the notion of property rights.</p>
<p>If Coach stole (via force or fraud) the property of victims A,B, and C, then only A,B and C have a just claim against Coach in the amount of their losses, plus recovery expenses. They have every right to hire an enforcement agency to recover these losses through Coach&#8217;s assets or future income.</p>
<p>In this case, the prosecutor &#8220;P&#8221;, enters the scene to punish Coach. He claims to represent A,B and C, but actually represents the state (and his own political aspirations &#8211; see Spitzer) whose interests are often adverse to the victim&#8217;s. Putting the man behind bars for 12 years completely eliminates any chance for him to repay his victims, and worse, the victims are forced to pay bear the costs (probably north of $1.2MM) for their theif&#8217;s upkeep for the next 12 years (along with the other local taxpayers).</p>
<p>Hardly what I would call &#8220;justice,&#8221; were I a victim of Coach&#8217;s actions.</p>
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		<title>By: Tom O'Neill</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2006/03/my-afternoon-at-the-boulder-county-justice-center.html/comment-page-1#comment-5865</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom O'Neill</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Mar 2006 00:38:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feld.com/wp/?p=938#comment-5865</guid>
		<description>Not only do I see no good in putting this man in a cell, it is in direct logical conflict with the notion of property rights.

If Coach stole (via force or fraud) the property of victims A,B, and C, then only A,B and C have a just claim against Coach in the amount of their losses, plus recovery expenses. They have every right to hire an enforcement agency to recover these losses through Coach&#039;s assets or future income.

In this case, the prosecutor &quot;P&quot;, enters the scene to punish Coach. He claims to represent A,B and C, but actually represents the state (and his own political aspirations - see Spitzer) whose interests are often adverse to the victim&#039;s. Putting the man behind bars for 12 years completely eliminates any chance for him to repay his victims, and worse, the victims are forced to pay bear the costs (probably north of $1.2MM) for their theif&#039;s upkeep for the next 12 years (along with the other local taxpayers).

Hardly what I would call &quot;justice,&quot; were I a victim of Coach&#039;s actions.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Not only do I see no good in putting this man in a cell, it is in direct logical conflict with the notion of property rights.</p>
<p>If Coach stole (via force or fraud) the property of victims A,B, and C, then only A,B and C have a just claim against Coach in the amount of their losses, plus recovery expenses. They have every right to hire an enforcement agency to recover these losses through Coach&#8217;s assets or future income.</p>
<p>In this case, the prosecutor &#8220;P&#8221;, enters the scene to punish Coach. He claims to represent A,B and C, but actually represents the state (and his own political aspirations &#8211; see Spitzer) whose interests are often adverse to the victim&#8217;s. Putting the man behind bars for 12 years completely eliminates any chance for him to repay his victims, and worse, the victims are forced to pay bear the costs (probably north of $1.2MM) for their theif&#8217;s upkeep for the next 12 years (along with the other local taxpayers).</p>
<p>Hardly what I would call &#8220;justice,&#8221; were I a victim of Coach&#8217;s actions.</p>
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		<title>By: Bob Corrigan</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2006/03/my-afternoon-at-the-boulder-county-justice-center.html/comment-page-1#comment-2535</link>
		<dc:creator>Bob Corrigan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 20 Mar 2006 21:27:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feld.com/wp/?p=938#comment-2535</guid>
		<description>What I find particularly sad is that Mr. Coach is obviously intelligent, capable (in his own way), and for lack of a better way of saying it, lost.

Instead of affording him some way of paying his debt to society in an active way, he&#039;s going to sit in a cell, doing nothing but suffering and counting time.

Everyone loses.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What I find particularly sad is that Mr. Coach is obviously intelligent, capable (in his own way), and for lack of a better way of saying it, lost.</p>
<p>Instead of affording him some way of paying his debt to society in an active way, he&#8217;s going to sit in a cell, doing nothing but suffering and counting time.</p>
<p>Everyone loses.</p>
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		<title>By: DeanR</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2006/03/my-afternoon-at-the-boulder-county-justice-center.html/comment-page-1#comment-2534</link>
		<dc:creator>DeanR</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 20 Mar 2006 19:06:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feld.com/wp/?p=938#comment-2534</guid>
		<description>
Brad - I too had an experience with Mr. Coach, he &quot;hired&quot; my company to build his website. My team worked over their Thanksgiving holiday in 2004 to get it done for his deadline of Dec 1st. As you can imagine, we got it done and it was pretty nice - my team went over and above.

Coach never did pay for the website, he left me holding the bag and I of course had to pay all of the team members out of my own pocket. Coach was a very good manipulator and strung me along for months thinking I&#039;d actually get paid. Ended up taking him to court (he didn&#039;t bother to show up to that nice looking Boulder County Court House for our hearing) and even after winning a judgement against him - never got much in the form of pay back.

Had he not been referred to me by a good friend (a mutual friend of ours) I probably would have not been so eager to please and do such a good job. He used my website for months and never did pay for it - and constantly made me feel as though I were the bad guy for hassling him for payment over and over again.

Anyway, what I&#039;m getting at is that there were two sides to this guy, you didn&#039;t get to view the side I did. I don&#039;t have much remorse for Mr. Coach, I hope that he spends the next 12 years thinking about all the little people like me whom he bilked that will get no rembursement.

Dean Rizzuto


</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Brad &#8211; I too had an experience with Mr. Coach, he &#8220;hired&#8221; my company to build his website. My team worked over their Thanksgiving holiday in 2004 to get it done for his deadline of Dec 1st. As you can imagine, we got it done and it was pretty nice &#8211; my team went over and above.</p>
<p>Coach never did pay for the website, he left me holding the bag and I of course had to pay all of the team members out of my own pocket. Coach was a very good manipulator and strung me along for months thinking I&#8217;d actually get paid. Ended up taking him to court (he didn&#8217;t bother to show up to that nice looking Boulder County Court House for our hearing) and even after winning a judgement against him &#8211; never got much in the form of pay back.</p>
<p>Had he not been referred to me by a good friend (a mutual friend of ours) I probably would have not been so eager to please and do such a good job. He used my website for months and never did pay for it &#8211; and constantly made me feel as though I were the bad guy for hassling him for payment over and over again.</p>
<p>Anyway, what I&#8217;m getting at is that there were two sides to this guy, you didn&#8217;t get to view the side I did. I don&#8217;t have much remorse for Mr. Coach, I hope that he spends the next 12 years thinking about all the little people like me whom he bilked that will get no rembursement.</p>
<p>Dean Rizzuto</p>
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		<title>By: Me</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2006/03/my-afternoon-at-the-boulder-county-justice-center.html/comment-page-1#comment-2533</link>
		<dc:creator>Me</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 20 Mar 2006 08:23:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feld.com/wp/?p=938#comment-2533</guid>
		<description>Wow, Brad, that picture brought back some memories!

I spent a couple days in that building in the 1980&#039;s.  An overused phrase - &quot;CHANGED MY LIFE&quot;.

I know it wasn&#039;t the point of your story, but I&#039;ll say it anyway, Nothing like a night in overcrowded jail to scare a middle class teenager back on track.

And to Rob, all crimes have a victim...there is no such thing as &quot;victimless crime&quot; in a democracy.  Prison has historically two purposes, punishment and deterrent, it now also has the purpose of rehab and unfortunately, containment.  It sounds like deterrent didn&#039;t work for Coach, it also sounds like rehab is working, and now punishment takes over.

I will agree with Allan that sentencing is often out of proportion to the crime itself.

When you reduce it to the personal level, it is not good for Coach, but he was responsible for his actions and personal responsibility is something many in America need to learn again.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wow, Brad, that picture brought back some memories!</p>
<p>I spent a couple days in that building in the 1980&#8217;s.  An overused phrase &#8211; &#8220;CHANGED MY LIFE&#8221;.</p>
<p>I know it wasn&#8217;t the point of your story, but I&#8217;ll say it anyway, Nothing like a night in overcrowded jail to scare a middle class teenager back on track.</p>
<p>And to Rob, all crimes have a victim&#8230;there is no such thing as &#8220;victimless crime&#8221; in a democracy.  Prison has historically two purposes, punishment and deterrent, it now also has the purpose of rehab and unfortunately, containment.  It sounds like deterrent didn&#8217;t work for Coach, it also sounds like rehab is working, and now punishment takes over.</p>
<p>I will agree with Allan that sentencing is often out of proportion to the crime itself.</p>
<p>When you reduce it to the personal level, it is not good for Coach, but he was responsible for his actions and personal responsibility is something many in America need to learn again.</p>
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		<title>By: genghis</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2006/03/my-afternoon-at-the-boulder-county-justice-center.html/comment-page-1#comment-2532</link>
		<dc:creator>genghis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 19 Mar 2006 10:07:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feld.com/wp/?p=938#comment-2532</guid>
		<description>Brad,

Thanks for a thought-provoking and thoughtful article, which illuminated for some the twisty paths which have developed in the American judicial system.

The slogan which runs &quot;If you can&#039;t do the time, don&#039;t do the crime!&quot; works for me here in England as well as it does in Boulder! The question asked of the jury was, &quot;Was this guy guilty?&quot;; and the answer was &quot;Yes!&quot; So the Coach was then slung on the pile of decisions left for the judge, who has been deputed by society to make these decisions on  its&#039; behalf.

I understand that you knew the guy pretty well when you were younger, but people do change, and the stand-up guy whom you knew is possibly no longer around!

Best of luck to you and to Amy, for as long as there are people such as yourselves who will stand up and state that this guy is not all bad, America will still stand tall in the eyes of many around the world!


</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Brad,</p>
<p>Thanks for a thought-provoking and thoughtful article, which illuminated for some the twisty paths which have developed in the American judicial system.</p>
<p>The slogan which runs &#8220;If you can&#8217;t do the time, don&#8217;t do the crime!&#8221; works for me here in England as well as it does in Boulder! The question asked of the jury was, &#8220;Was this guy guilty?&#8221;; and the answer was &#8220;Yes!&#8221; So the Coach was then slung on the pile of decisions left for the judge, who has been deputed by society to make these decisions on  its&#8217; behalf.</p>
<p>I understand that you knew the guy pretty well when you were younger, but people do change, and the stand-up guy whom you knew is possibly no longer around!</p>
<p>Best of luck to you and to Amy, for as long as there are people such as yourselves who will stand up and state that this guy is not all bad, America will still stand tall in the eyes of many around the world!</p>
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		<title>By: Ben Neumann</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2006/03/my-afternoon-at-the-boulder-county-justice-center.html/comment-page-1#comment-2531</link>
		<dc:creator>Ben Neumann</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 18 Mar 2006 22:55:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feld.com/wp/?p=938#comment-2531</guid>
		<description>I always have mixed emotions when I hear or read a story such as the one of &quot;Coach&quot;; especially, if there is a personal connection. It&#039;s never easy to decide someone&#039;s faith, but when you step back a little and try to boil things down, most people usually end up laying in the bed they made for themselves. Now, under our current judicial system, I believe Coach should be able to make it out after 6-8 years, if he does ok. I know, it doesn&#039;t make it better right now, but there&#039;s still panty of life left to be lived after he serves his time. The one thing Coach needs to do, however, is learn his lesson and move on from there! It</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I always have mixed emotions when I hear or read a story such as the one of &#8220;Coach&#8221;; especially, if there is a personal connection. It&#8217;s never easy to decide someone&#8217;s faith, but when you step back a little and try to boil things down, most people usually end up laying in the bed they made for themselves. Now, under our current judicial system, I believe Coach should be able to make it out after 6-8 years, if he does ok. I know, it doesn&#8217;t make it better right now, but there&#8217;s still panty of life left to be lived after he serves his time. The one thing Coach needs to do, however, is learn his lesson and move on from there! It</p>
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		<title>By: Chris</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2006/03/my-afternoon-at-the-boulder-county-justice-center.html/comment-page-1#comment-2530</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 18 Mar 2006 22:43:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feld.com/wp/?p=938#comment-2530</guid>
		<description>Generally I love to read what is said around here. But I disagree so heavily with this rant. Amazing low one sided it all is. If all you read is this, it seems like &quot;coach&quot; has been convited and sentenced only because of his past crimes, nothing about what got him 12 MORE YEARS. What has rehab done for criminals in any country except allowed them to commit more crimes? Maybe we need more extreme versions of punishment, that will actually act as a deterent to commit crimes in the first place. But until that happens I will be stopping my RSS feed to this worthless drivle.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Generally I love to read what is said around here. But I disagree so heavily with this rant. Amazing low one sided it all is. If all you read is this, it seems like &#8220;coach&#8221; has been convited and sentenced only because of his past crimes, nothing about what got him 12 MORE YEARS. What has rehab done for criminals in any country except allowed them to commit more crimes? Maybe we need more extreme versions of punishment, that will actually act as a deterent to commit crimes in the first place. But until that happens I will be stopping my RSS feed to this worthless drivle.</p>
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		<title>By: Tillerman</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2006/03/my-afternoon-at-the-boulder-county-justice-center.html/comment-page-1#comment-2529</link>
		<dc:creator>Tillerman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 18 Mar 2006 17:46:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feld.com/wp/?p=938#comment-2529</guid>
		<description>Fascinating story. Makes us realise that we only ever see one side of many of the people we think we know.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Fascinating story. Makes us realise that we only ever see one side of many of the people we think we know.</p>
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		<title>By: Rob</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2006/03/my-afternoon-at-the-boulder-county-justice-center.html/comment-page-1#comment-2528</link>
		<dc:creator>Rob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 18 Mar 2006 06:59:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feld.com/wp/?p=938#comment-2528</guid>
		<description>This sort of thing is so political.

Unfortunately, Americans, as a group of people, are pretty stupid. That&#039;s not to say there aren&#039;t some switched-on Americans, but that most Americans are dumb. It&#039;s a problem of too much money, and thinking done on their behalf. It&#039;s not - usually - their fault, either.

Anyway, for dumb people, the most politically attractive thing to be is black and white (starkly contrasted - nothing to do with actual colour) about things. It shows &quot;strength&quot; and &quot;leadership&quot; (apparently). Your politicians are - by and large - black and white. Your media is black and white. You see the world in black and white terms. Good versus evil. Them and us. Terrorists and non-terrorists.

So, unfortunatly for you, and sometimes the rest of the world, the people who end up in positions of power/judgement in the USA are people who act in black and white.

Hence the coach has a good side, and an evil side. The judge is telling you that this is a simple cut-and-diced case: you missed the evil; the judge sees lots of evil in their work, and evil needs to be punished. End of story.

So where&#039;s the logic? Where&#039;s the rehabilitation? Where are the victims of this man&#039;s crime?

Well, nowhere.

Thanks for the post, Brad, and well done for taking the time to play your part - that&#039;s all you can do.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This sort of thing is so political.</p>
<p>Unfortunately, Americans, as a group of people, are pretty stupid. That&#8217;s not to say there aren&#8217;t some switched-on Americans, but that most Americans are dumb. It&#8217;s a problem of too much money, and thinking done on their behalf. It&#8217;s not &#8211; usually &#8211; their fault, either.</p>
<p>Anyway, for dumb people, the most politically attractive thing to be is black and white (starkly contrasted &#8211; nothing to do with actual colour) about things. It shows &#8220;strength&#8221; and &#8220;leadership&#8221; (apparently). Your politicians are &#8211; by and large &#8211; black and white. Your media is black and white. You see the world in black and white terms. Good versus evil. Them and us. Terrorists and non-terrorists.</p>
<p>So, unfortunatly for you, and sometimes the rest of the world, the people who end up in positions of power/judgement in the USA are people who act in black and white.</p>
<p>Hence the coach has a good side, and an evil side. The judge is telling you that this is a simple cut-and-diced case: you missed the evil; the judge sees lots of evil in their work, and evil needs to be punished. End of story.</p>
<p>So where&#8217;s the logic? Where&#8217;s the rehabilitation? Where are the victims of this man&#8217;s crime?</p>
<p>Well, nowhere.</p>
<p>Thanks for the post, Brad, and well done for taking the time to play your part &#8211; that&#8217;s all you can do.</p>
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		<title>By: Derek Scruggs</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2006/03/my-afternoon-at-the-boulder-county-justice-center.html/comment-page-1#comment-2527</link>
		<dc:creator>Derek Scruggs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 18 Mar 2006 03:55:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feld.com/wp/?p=938#comment-2527</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t remember the name, but ISTR hearing something a while back about a local coach getting in bad trouble. Sorry you had to get in the middle of it.

To sit in a courtroom is to experience the edge cases of society.. I don&#039;t envy you.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t remember the name, but ISTR hearing something a while back about a local coach getting in bad trouble. Sorry you had to get in the middle of it.</p>
<p>To sit in a courtroom is to experience the edge cases of society.. I don&#8217;t envy you.</p>
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		<title>By: Darren Fast</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2006/03/my-afternoon-at-the-boulder-county-justice-center.html/comment-page-1#comment-2526</link>
		<dc:creator>Darren Fast</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 17 Mar 2006 23:08:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feld.com/wp/?p=938#comment-2526</guid>
		<description>Thanks for sharing your story.  I agree that there are no easy answers as it all depends on your perspective on the story.  I suppose someone can find fault with all of us if they look hard enough.  It&#039;s good to know that people can see the good in us too, you are a good friend to the coach and I suspect that he will continue to need your friendship as the years go by.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for sharing your story.  I agree that there are no easy answers as it all depends on your perspective on the story.  I suppose someone can find fault with all of us if they look hard enough.  It&#8217;s good to know that people can see the good in us too, you are a good friend to the coach and I suspect that he will continue to need your friendship as the years go by.</p>
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		<title>By: Alan Shimel</title>
		<link>http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2006/03/my-afternoon-at-the-boulder-county-justice-center.html/comment-page-1#comment-2525</link>
		<dc:creator>Alan Shimel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 17 Mar 2006 20:41:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feld.com/wp/?p=938#comment-2525</guid>
		<description>Justice in America, he will get 12 years and someone raping someone or committing a violent armed crime will get much less. There used to be the notion of rehabilitation, but our &quot;compassionate conservatisim&quot; has replaced that with revenge and punishment.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Justice in America, he will get 12 years and someone raping someone or committing a violent armed crime will get much less. There used to be the notion of rehabilitation, but our &#8220;compassionate conservatisim&#8221; has replaced that with revenge and punishment.</p>
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